IFRT Members Community (Open)

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann

I'm glad you brought up the point that you don't like to be called an "intellectual freedom fighter."  Personally, I don't mind calling myself an intellectual freedom fighter because we are fighting against censorship.  However, if preferred, intellectual freedom defender, intellectual freedom keeper, intellectual freedom protector works, too.

To all who've mentioned IF training.  I think it's super that regular staff (whether public or school) are trained to handle intellectual freedom issues! Kudos to the library systems and schools who realize the importance of training.  Sometimes challenges are elevated to the top and the outcome is not shared. Then the question becomes-why do we train people on how to handle intellectual freedom issues when they don't get to handle them? There needs to be more transparency in some organizations.  Just my opinion.

As I was saying in my post to GNCRT, I understand the many reasons why institutions choose to resolve things "privately." The down side is--keeping things private gives an appearance that challenges and bans are not as prevalent as the "olden" days.  We all know that's not true. Of course, by its very nature, we may never know how many "private challenges" happen annually. That invisibility make backfire on us. Numbers effect resources, viability of groups, functionality, etc.

Letting good people decide whether they want their material challenges resolved publicly or privately is both positive and negative. Do know that there are good people on all sides.  We are afraid of the media blowing everything out of proportion and "the other people."  I personally know of journalists who are advocates of intellectual freedom. I know plenty of level-headed people who are intellectual freedom advocates. There are lawyers, journalists, IT people--people from many proffessions among us.  "People" are not all mobs-they are "us."  We must learn to trust that there are people willing to help on the outside as well as the inside.

Thanks for the conversation!

Ann

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann

I'm glad you brought up the point that you don't like to be called an "intellectual freedom fighter."  Personally, I don't mind calling myself an intellectual freedom fighter because we are fighting against censorship.  However, if preferred, intellectual freedom defender, intellectual freedom keeper, intellectual freedom protector works, too.

To all who've mentioned IF training.  I think it's super that regular staff (whether public or school) are trained to handle intellectual freedom issues! Kudos to the library systems and schools who realize the importance of training.  Sometimes challenges are elevated to the top and the outcome is not shared. Then the question becomes-why do we train people on how to handle intellectual freedom issues when they don't get to handle them? There needs to be more transparency in some organizations.  Just my opinion.

As I was saying in my post to GNCRT, I understand the many reasons why institutions choose to resolve things "privately." The down side is--keeping things private gives an appearance that challenges and bans are not as prevalent as the "olden" days.  We all know that's not true. Of course, by its very nature, we may never know how many "private challenges" happen annually. That invisibility make backfire on us. Numbers effect resources, viability of groups, functionality, etc.

Letting good people decide whether they want their material challenges resolved publicly or privately is both positive and negative. Do know that there are good people on all sides.  We are afraid of the media blowing everything out of proportion and "the other people."  I personally know of journalists who are advocates of intellectual freedom. I know plenty of level-headed people who are intellectual freedom advocates. There are lawyers, journalists, IT people--people from many proffessions among us.  "People" are not all mobs-they are "us."  We must learn to trust that there are people willing to help on the outside as well as the inside.

Thanks for the conversation!

Ann

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann

Hello everyone,

I appreciate the robust discussion from GNCRT and IFRT.  I apologize if I'm working backwards.  More responses to come.

Please hear me out about "private challenges."  And you are right, John, most libraries are afraid that a challenge to a book can be negative PR, it could affect levies and it could open up more challenges. It's a real business concern.  It's the same way with the schools--parents may complain more and teachers may start pulling their own collections--funding could be on the line. Private challenges seem the way to go. This is the pattern most have challenges to books have taken.  We tell them, please report to the OIF, the CBLDF, NCAC and all the organizations that promise to uphold intellectual freedom say "No problem.  We can handle it."  And the organizations do an excellent job!

I am concerned, however, that inevitably this creates a bottle-neck. As "well-meaning" as organizations such as OIF, CBLDF among others are in protecting our right to read, fighting these battles for the rest of us is like holding our hands or assuming there will be a mob (all the time) if word gets out to the public. It's assuming the public can't be trusted.  Most of us are intelligent people who are capable of fighting censorship battles alongside of you.  Because everything is dealt "privately"--how can reinforcements be called to attend board meetings? How can we write public officials about what challenges to books are happening when we don't know what they are? Some challenges are timely.  We need to know when they are happening in real time. We complain the media is a vacuum but if you block media from the beginning, how can they cover the story? After the form has been privately submitted, who are the trusted individuals?

Yes, FOIA allows the public to see everything and that's a good thing. It can help us strategize, prepare and look for patterns for the next banned book challenge. I'm really more concerned about current challenges and finding the source. Some state intellectual freedom groups are being disbanded.  Maybe, my question really should be--how can the people help?

Thanks so much for your input!

Ann